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Party where each person represented a different country

Hello. This is my first post. I've long ignored my dreams, but I'm starting to listen. I'm starting to read Jung's The Red Book.

My dream: I was at a party with so many people I couldn't count. Each person at the party represented a different country. They played a game where they had to say something nice about the country that the person next to them was representing.

It was really that simple. The people looked like average people around my age. I did not actually hear what anyone said about another country. I just heard the rules being announced by someone who I did not see it. The dream was very fast, and there wasn't time for me to socialize with anyone. I was simply there, and the announcement was made, and people seemed to be talking to each other but I couldn't hear any specific words being spoken.

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 33, male, United States

Re: Party where each person represented a different country

Underwater Ruin,
Perhaps the best way to explain your dream is to expound on the dream images/actions and what they might represent. One important thing to understand is that all dreams have at least two meanings/level of applications. Another is dreams are about the emotional energies that govern your attitudes and actions and the underlying reasons for them {the underlying reasons having to do with foundations for your attitudes and personality}. With only limited info about your personal life I can confidently provide an outline of these emotional energies. Actual personal experiences usually require in depth personal information.

The many people your age would represent {on one level} the many emotional aspects of your psyche. Not being able to count them may suggest there are many emotional energies that are in play that may be causing stress or additional emotional energies. On another level {recent personal experiences included} the dream may be addressing actual events where you are among people your age where there were experiences that caused emotional charges. The underlying foundations come into play in these instances because the attitudes you possess would affect your thinking and/or behavior {example: an introverted, shy person would normally refrain from being in crowds}.

The different countries would also represent aspects of your psyche but more in a governing way. The different countries would the different emotional energies that form your attitudes {early life foundations}. With personal experiences the representation of different countries may involve people not on your level or who share your principles. It may involve actual experiences with people from other cultures {again, these would involve personal experiences I can not specifically name but only outline with suggestions}.

The playing of games on a personal level may be pointing to actual experiences where 'emotional games' were in play. On a 'higher' level {outline of emotional energies related to foundations/attitudes/personal traits} these emotional experiences may be playing with you causing a need to find within yourself 'nice' aspects related to personal experiences. There are 'rules' or principles you live by {from foundations and/or earlier life experiences that helped form your attitudes/personality}. It could be 'just being there' may point to a need to be recognized in personal events. In an outline the recognition of your established attitudes may be needed so you can make changes that add positively in your life {being nice}.

It is difficult from this one dream to pinpoint both energies of an outline nature and certainly of a personal nature. Most likely there was more to the dream you may not remember that would help. The outline of the energies seem to point to a need to recognize aspects about yourself that when understood would help in your waking life {say something nice about the country}. It may require a change of attitude which would be psychologically grounded {foundations}. As a child you may not have received the proper attention from parents/peers and these experiences are ingrained in your psyche and are now a part of your personality. You may need to reconnect to those foundational experiences so to understand why you have make changes in personal settings where you feel 'out of the loop' among other people. There may have been recent experiences that are associated with these foundational energies the dream is focused.

A response to my analysis would be appreciated. I learn something from every dream and knowing whether my analysis help explain the images/actions in your dream is most beneficial in learning more about dreams. It may also help in better understanding the dream's message.

On the subject of Jung's Red Book. I have yet to read the book but understand it focuses on the inner life of Jung {as does most of his works}. Your interest in Jung may be a change of focus in your life, one of understanding your inner life so you can make needed changes in your outer life {making changes of the negatives in your foundations which will result in a more positive outer life}. If you are really interested in Jung I suggest you purchase Anthony Stevens audio book Jung: A Very Short Introduction. It provides a brief but in-depth analysis of Jungian psyche.


Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 67 Cocoa, Fl

Re: Party where each person represented a different country

Thank you for your response, Jerry.

While reading your analysis, the 3 pieces that stood out were the idea of governance in relation to the countries. I had not thought about this.

I have felt split in my life. There used to be very different versions of myself, like a version among co-workers, a version among classmates, a version among family, a version among love interests, a version among friends, and a version alone. I think everyone is split like this. For example, you may talk politics with your family but not at work. However, rather than avoid talking about certain subjects at work, I would lie and say what I thought the person I was talking to would hear. I didn't know how to tell someone that I'd prefer not to discuss a subject like politics at work. I would, in a sense, become another person.

Recently, I was inspired to not lie after listening to Jordan Peterson, and accept the consequences. In this video, he talks about the negative affects of lying: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfEK-Pmi7v0

The second idea that stood out was where being among people my age causes "emotional charges." I do feel quite different from other people. I have an unusually high IQ, and I think I have OCD, although I haven't sought anyone to diagnose me.

The third part that stood out was, "As a child you may not have received the proper attention from parents/peers and these experiences are ingrained in your psyche and are now a part of your personality." Growing up, I should have been in a gifted program, but I doubt that thought ever crossed my parents' minds. My parents were very violent to one another, and would scream at each other daily. My mother very likely had borderline personality disorder, although she is not the type to ever seek diagnosis or help.

I often did not like things that other children liked. Teachers often said I was very mature. I felt really alone, and still do, although I'm less afraid of the world as an adult.

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 33 Male USA

Have You Posted Before? Date of Last Post {Use Search and Your Post Name to Help Find Last Post} 2017-06-14

Re: Party where each person represented a different country

Underwater Ruin,
I apologize for not getting back to you sooner. So much to do in retirement and so little time to do it all.

Let's look at my analysis of your dream first then I will address your response.

The 'each person represented a different country' would on a personal experience level {literal experiences} represented the differences you felt about yourself compared to other children your age and probably as an adult as well. Your inability to state exactly how you feel {instead you have to lie} may be having to 'play games' in 'saying something nice' so you can feel accepted/fit in with your peers. Being a short dream doesn't provide much more to work with and what you don't remember about the dream would expand on this.

On a deeper level the 'emotional games' are a result of your childhood. Again without more info about the dream as well as your personal life I ma very limited in providing 'matching' dialog from the dream to your personal life. Your problem childhood undoubtedly played into your developed attitudes. Just how would require much more info about your childhood and relationship with parents as well as others. My analysis of 'The different countries would also represent aspects of your psyche but more in a governing way' addresses these emotional energies. You have to 'play' emotional games as an adult because of the emotional games you grew up with. You 'live' by a different set of rules because you are different intellectually. This would be like trying to put a square plug into a round hole. It will never fit until you find a 'plug' that fits. Thus has been your problem throughout life and will not change until you get to the core of your emotional issues.

To your response about being two different people. Being different requires you to be that other person. You can not be your true self. In Jungian psyche the path to wholeness and a happy life is to be your true self. Most people live 'inauthentic' for many various reasons. Often it is the material world verses the true self. Yours is different in you do have this intellectual difference. If you do have OCD it may be because of an abnormality, an imbalance in neurotransmitters in your brain. If so drugs can help. But being your true self requires psychological therapy {almost everyone could use therapy for one reason or another}.

To the 'being your true self' aspect. My childhood issues were father related which as an adult led me to look for 'love in all the wrong places'. I had no inkling of the unconscious energies that were governing my actions until I discovered Jungian psyche {from an experience that changed my in one night}. When I did begin to study Jung {in 1992} I discovered not only the reasons for my actions as an adult, I also discovered my 'gift' of understanding dreams. Underneath all the garbage in my life was this valuable asset that allowed my to expand my horizons and develop my creative self {I also am self taught in web design} as a means of expression. It was not until I could express my true self, that other part of me that was hidden, that I was able to escape the bounds of childhood. This is standard 'hero journey' stuff and finding my inner hero allowed me to escape my shadow and be the 'best I can be'. The hero journey in myth is the universal patterns of cultures as a whole. And these patterns are discernible by analyzing our dreams because dreams area direct link to the unconscious. Look within and you will discover the true self and what is keeping your from being that person.

If you have a real interest in Jung I suggest you follow up on it. It will challenge your intellect because his stuff is very deep. IQ wise it should fit with your psyche. But all in all it is merely 'common sense' because it is natural law {see archetypes}. I aso suggest if possible to seek psychological therapy. having to lie your way through life suggests a deep neurosis. My disadvantage psychologically in life was pretty much a fixed pattern {Luke Skywalker seeking his father is my general personal motif}. From what you state in your response you have a much deeper and distorted pattern of behavior that needs remedy.


Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 67 Cocoa, Fl

Re: Party where each person represented a different country

Thank you, Jerry, for your thoughtful response. Please do not worry about taking your time. I understand you are busy, and I appreciate the care you put into writing.

I appreciate your patience in my delay, which was partly due to the business of life, but also because I wanted to process what you wrote.

I think everything you wrote in the last post is 100% accurate.

Therapy may be helpful to try again. I tried it with 4 different individuals several years ago. The first was helpful because he was the first person who listened to what I said seriously. He helped me understand my family, and how they affected me. I moved, and was in school when I worked with the next 3. Those experiences did not help. I was feeling suicidal, but I lied and did not tell them because I was afraid I would be institutionalized against my will, my family would find out and that would cause me pain, and it would cause problems in school work. I did not understand my OCD symptoms at the time, so I did not talk about those. It was not due to dishonestly, but I denied there was anything wrong with my obsessive behavior. I partially justified my behavior by thinking everyone else was careless, but it reached a point where I was obsessively sanding my apartment's trim, trying to obtain a level of smoothness that is physically impossible. But by that time, I was ready to move and leave therapy.

During therapy, I tried every medication, including older medications. We actually ran out of options.

Therapy may help given my new knowledge. I would like to do online therapy because I like communicating in writing, but the last time I researched it was not officially supported by the field.

I have ran up to page 300 of the Red Book by Jung. I have trouble comprehending even simple books, but I hope something from the book seeps into my brain.

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 33 Male USA

Re: Party where each person represented a different country

Underwater Rain,
First let me say the pseudonym name you use Underwater Rain is emblematic if not symbolic of the unconscious energies within your psyche. Water is a common dream symbol and always points to unconscious energies which produce conscious emotions. Underwater suggests you are very much under the influence of these energies. Rain is an out pouring of emotions. Your situation in life pretty much is unconsciously driven, not only psychologically but neurologically.

Your OCD is a neurological condition which requires medication to bring balance chemically to the brain. But the psychological conditions add to the neurological issues and both need treatment. Therapy is required but as you stated it takes two {you and the therapist} to make it work. Complete trust in the person you are working with is a must. One major difference between Freudian and Jungian clinical approach is Freud thought it important to keep a distance from his patients while Jung believed it most important to have a relationship {professional} with those he treated. The therapist is as much a part of the process as the therapy. This may be one reason you had little success with the last three therapists you worked with. The therapist must be able to get into the patient's head and see what is there. Drugs can be a part of the process but psychologically they are merely a temporary fix. Not until the unconscious issues are resolved can there be a complete healing. Getting to what is going on in the head is the major task, and obstacle in determining what energies are in control.

This is where dreams come in. Dreams are a direct link to the unconscious and are all about the emotions and the energies that support the emotions.Whereas Freudian analyst will use dreams as a secondary tool and opt for 'couch' therapy and free association. Jungians use dreams as a primary tool and encourage the patient to open up to the dream as well as the therapist. Trust is most important and Jungian therapists go to great extremes to form a bond between patient and therapist.

As for online treatment. Clinically it is not something you will find online. But technically it is available. it is what Jung called Self Individuation. Individuation is a process of transformation whereby the personal and collective unconscious are brought into consciousness {e.g., by means of dreams, active imagination} to be assimilated into the whole personality. It is a completely natural process necessary for the integration of the psyche. Self individuation is 'going it alone' in your own therapy, being the patient and the analyst. I know it can work because I have been involved in the process {successfully} for many years. It requires self education of Jungian concepts, studying his methods and philosophy to gain insights to how the psyche {mind} works. Most don't realize that his concepts are pretty much 'common sense' in they are inherent aspects of the human condition {the immune system and the dream being therapeutic tools provided by nature}. Tapping into the 'soul' is how success is found {soul in Greek means psyche which is our individual psychology}, delineating the inner personality to the conscious ego {the ego is the body and its wants/desires whereas the soul is the whole self in complete balance, not subjugated by the inferior ego self}. What is inside is the true person and what is on the outside is what the ego wants the person to believe is the true identity. Understanding the difference is not a simple as it might seem but when you take the journey inward you will find so much about yourself you never knew. The ego tries to hide this true self for selfish reasons related to an undisciplined life. That life begins in the womb and everything that comes after birth is a part of the foundations the life is built on. Overcoming those early years is basically what we all are tasked in reconciling the out of balance emotional energies.

You started with Jung's Red book. That is 'deep' stuff and takes years of study to understand much of what it contains. I suggest you use my Power of Dreams website to start your self therapy {if you are truly interested}. Start with the quick links at the top of the page and go from there. Learn about the anima/animus, the shadow and the Self. Discover how the archetypal energies play a major role in how life is lived {inherent aspects we all are born with, a pre-set of instructions that when not met leans to an out-of-balanced' psyche and emotional life}. There is so much to learn about the inner self that when you begin the journey {seriously} you find yourself in another world. This world is what comes up at night in our dreams and is a production/play/story of the dreamer's true life {including the inner secrets of the dreamer's life}. The life can never be completely whole until the unconscious life becomes conscious. Working with your dreams and self therapy is a path to wholeness, if you can survive the journey. Either die by conscious intent without ever knowing the true self, or risk survival by going inward and discovering the truths and bringing them out so you can be that true self.

Then hero in mythology is the story of the inward journey. When you go inward you become the hero in your own life.

Jerry Gifford

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 67 Cocoa, Fl

Re: Party where each person represented a different country

My username is actually "Underwater Ruin," not "Rain," but I think your interpretation is interesting and applicable. :) My fascination with the ocean as a child proceeding my actual visiting the ocean when I was 12. The ocean is simultaneously heavenly and hellish. It's heavenly with it's beauty. For example, the background image on this page. It's hellish with its dark depths, but also with its great expanses with unknowns lurking beneath.

Looking at the ocean is like looking at the stars. One feels infinity.

I would like to talk with a Jungian therapist. I will investigate your Power of Dreams website.

In this video, Dr. Peterson discusses integrating the shadow: https://www.reddit.com/r/Jung/comments/5sxzq2/jordan_peterson_integrating_your_shadow_self/. It is helping motivate me to do so.

He also discusses how people should burn off their deadwood on a regular basis, here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44f3mxcsI50&t=1788s If you wait for your deadwood to accumulate, when it does burn, it will take a large amount, perhaps all, with you. It's better to take medicine on a regular basis than neglect oneself and become hospitalized.

This is a truly great idea: "Then hero in mythology is the story of the inward journey. When you go inward you become the hero in your own life."

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 33 Male USA

Have You Posted Before? Date of Last Post {Use Search and Your Post Name to Help Find Last Post} 2017-06-27

Re: Party where each person represented a different country

Sometimes my eyesight decides me. Ruin could be as good as rain since the unconscious motivators can lead to 'ruin' in the conscious life. Underwater would then be the unconscious energies that ruin/govern the conscious actions. We all have some type of unconscious motivators and usually they begin/come from earliest childhood. Reconciling the -ruins- is what the dream is attempting to do.

To get a full understanding of the hero read Joseph Campbell. It was his The Power of Myth series of videos {with Bill Moyers} that began my journey inward and led me to discover I was an 'intuitive Jungian'. That led to years of study of Jung and all the various philosophers and thinkers associated with the psyche {Greek for soul}. The heroes of myth are the basic patterns of human behavior seeking wholeness. Luke Skywalker seeking his father {love and acceptance} is my basic pattern. Resolving the energies related to that search is how one becomes the hero in their own life. It is a journey, psychological in nature, a search of the inner world to resolve the emotional issues experienced daily in the outer world.

Note: Much of the Campbell's interview with Moyers was filmed at George Lucas' Skywalker ranch. The Star Wars trilogy is based on Campbell's Monomyth. Lucas was a student of Campbell.

As for the Peterson video. I am not big on anything religious oriented when it comes to psychology. I have not watched to the video and it may be a good source. I tend to stay strictly with bonafide Jungian authors like Robert Johnson, James Hillman and my favorite Marion Woodman. Woodman's Dreams: Language of the Soul is a must when understanding dreams.


Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 67 Cocoa, Fl

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