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Let's Get Metaphysical

Metaphysical

Derived from the Greek meta ta physika ("after the things of nature"); referring to an idea, doctrine, or posited reality outside of human sense perception. In modern philosophical terminology, metaphysics refers to the studies of what cannot be reached through objective studies of material reality. Areas of metaphysical studies include ontology, cosmology, and often, epistemology.


In the post Out of body experience or psychic? May posed the question of psychic abilities through dreams. I believe we can but I also believe such abilities are inherent in our human DNA, an aspect of the human psyche, and not an intraterrestrial experience. Spirituality is thought of as a metaphysical subject but Jung believed it to be an aspect of who we are. If he is right then it is not hard to believe other metaphysical abilities may be possible also. There are plenty of people in this world who do have psychic abilities. But can just anyone develop a higher degree of psychic ability? Dreams are an excellent way to examine the possibilities. You are already within the realm of deeper knowledge, so where better to access knowledge not normally available through conscious means? There is no problem with finding qualified people to undertake the task since there is an abundance of advanced 'students' among those who frequent the Dream Forum.

Any thoughts on this subject? If anyone has had personal experiences of psychic events, posting those experiences may provide insights for others.

Gerard

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Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

interesting,
make of this what you will,

i see a red sea,in it are tribes of indians,(surfers are like tribes,)they are waiting for the big wave,
two waves approach,i swim under the first one and take the second one,it is huge,and it it keeps coming and coming inland swamping towns,i see people running for their lives.
this is a genuine vision i had in a dream ,
the following day ,we all know what happened in asia,
and not only that,it was the second wave that did the worst damage.
my associations were,
indian ocean,giant wave,
premonition or meaningful coincidence?
i choose to remain open about it.
steve.

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Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

Geratd,
Possible personal examples of the intuitive/metaphysical aspect...

1. Dreamt of my father and Nelson (2nd father of sorts) the night Lee (mentor, coworker, held in high regard) died. Father told me death is not an end, we go on, not the same, but not an end. In waking life, Lee died that night, unexpected heart attack. Both father and Nelson had died any years past. Nelson and Lee closely resembled each other in physical appearance. The dream occured in a car, which I think symbolizes death is a vehicle, of transformation.

2. Dreamt of being 'awakened' from sleep, into the void, Carrie a speck of energy/light, led by the Jesuit/Frannscican priest character (first apperance of this character). She changed form so I could recognize her. We spoke, she thanked me, hugged, said our good byes. I wanted to know where whe was going and go with her. He would not let her answer me and prevented me from going with them. (He never spoke, telepathic communication although I could not receive this.) She then left with him. Woke sobbing at 2:10 am, laid crying for some time. Waking life, Carrie died that night, was in a coma for several weeks before she died. When the phone rang that morning 'knew' it was someone calling to tell me Carrie had died. I titled the dream 'If you listen...'.

Dream 2 also plays a part in atonement. While I think of Carrie often, in June 06, had an especially deep 'feeling and thought' of her triggered by a song. Reviewed my dream journal for this dream, and at the time, found the association with atonement. In my Psyche the Jesuit/Franciscan character represents that which holds the ultimate power in life.

Kind regards,
Kathy

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Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

A lot of what Carl Jung proposes about inherent aspects of the psyche are contraversial. Perhaps one of the most is that we humans have an inherent spiritual aspect. We've discussed often the difference between spirituality and religion but the question of an inherent spiritual self is much harder to discern. Now comes a study by a Harvard biologist who proposes that humans are programmed with a moral grammar wired into their neural circuits by evolution. He argues that 'the grammar generates instant moral judgments which, in part because of the quick decisions that must be made in life-or-death situations, are inaccessible to the conscious mind'. Dr. Hauser developed the idea that moral behavior, like language behavior, is acquired with the help of an innate set of rules that unfolds early in a child’s development.

So what does this say about Jung's hypothoses of an inherent spiritual Self? For me it solidifies Jung's view. The study furthers the possibility that within brain's connectivity and electrochemistry that are programmed sets rules of behavior, a subject that Jung was a pioneer {Jung's personality types}. This is totally in line with what Jung proposed. His emperical studies of the human psyche have been verified with more recent studies from different fields in ontology, cosmology, and epistemology.. Once again I have cause to say 'Jung got it right'.

An Evolutionary Theory of Right and Wrong

Gerard

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Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

Steve,
If you don't mind, would like to ask a question regarding your experience. I understand the question appears to ask for speculation, yet with your deep knowledge of Self, I believe you would 'divine' rather than speculate...

At the time, had you a clear understanding of the dream meaning prior to the tsunami, clear preknowlege of the actual event, would this have had influence on you? If so, in what way? I know this is a broad question but one which holds personal interest.

Kind regards,
Kathy

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Re: Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

hi kathy,
i didn't start telling everyone that there was going to be a disaster in asia due to a tsunami,
but i was filled with foreboding ,that something terrible was going to happen,and it involved the images i saw,

i felt later that if it represented issues that i had repressed it would have returned in another nightmare ,
but it didn't,it was resolved the following day as i watched the events unfold on tv,with my jaw on the floor,i have to say.
yes it has had an effect on me,this was one of many i have had,
i have struggled with them,as gerard has rightly stated on occasions,this is not the function of dreams,
but i have to say that,if the function of dreams is to balance the lopsided attitudes we hold,
then if you do not believe it possible, that the human psyche is capable of such things,
then that in itself must come under the title,
a lopsided attitude,
i have been guilty of this,i have been sceptical to say the least.

it is impossible for a lump of meat inside your head to have knowledge of future events ,that are not based on past experience,conjecture,or subliminal perception,
i feel that if this is true,then premonitions etc come from somewhere else,
where,i don't have a clue,
the collective unconscious will do,but the sages speak of it by many names.
i hope somewhere in my babbling i have answered your questions,
regards steve

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Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

Steve,
Thank you for your candid response. You answered the question I asked. To take this a step further…if you had ‘psychic’ information (exact details - what, where, when) prior to an actual event, whether on an individual or massive scale like the tsunami, before the event, then what? What effect would this have on your intellect, emotions, or even physical? And would you work to develop this aspect?

Here too skepticism is a prerequisite when examining purported psychic events. Although I disagree the primary function of dreams is directed to the physical existence, to psychological wholeness. In the two dream examples posted the inference I gathered was I could not yet understand and that after death is not angels in heaven all the mysteries revealed. Perhaps the mysteries of this existence, but that that existence also held mysteries and a form of 'Self' work. This leads me to think dreams all encompassing rather than of singular function. And that the work we do here is one stage in successive stages continuing after physical death. All supposition, of course!!

Thanks again!
Kathy

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Re: Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

hi kathy,
in answer to your question i can only say,
i have never had the detail that would allow me to make one ayota of difference.
so whats it all for?
i believe that this type of experience in my case,
has served as a compensation for my narrow view on things psychic,
joseph campbell said,
your idea of god becomes your final barrier,
its a peak experience to break past it,
so this must be true of other things aswell,
including what a dream is,
this is limited by whatever school of thought you choose to follow,
but it is only a word,
these things we call dreams must work on many levels,
it is the only explanation for the diversity of our experience .
jung for me speaks the best,he had his own psychic experiences.and he was a logical scientist,
if you have not read it,
memories ,dreams, reflections.is a must if you seek some sort of validation of your own experience,
i think there are a lot of people who choose not to mention their own psychic experiences,for fear of ridicule,or just lack of confidence,
it must be a peak experience to break past that,
steve



steve

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Re: Re: Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

hi kathy ,just remembered something which relates to fear of ridicule etc.
it was a dream i had a while back,
i found a magic spring bubbling up out of the earth,
i drank from it and it was amazing,
because of this feeling i wanted to share it,
jesus appeared and told me to hide it,
i put rocks in front to conceal it,
by putting my ear to the wall i could hear the spring ,
gerard used the word gnosis,secret knowledge,and i realized what he meant,
you have to be careful who you mention it to.
regards steve

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Re: Let's Get Metaphysical

It works with me mainly with music and post.

For example I will think of a song and then hear it on the radio or someone playing it a day or so later (not just predictable playlists either lol)
Also I will think about a magazine being delivered or a parcel and then the next day it arrives ( not only expected deliveries/dates etc)!

I think I may have a thing about 'gifts' as I see music and things being delivered through the post as 'treats', gifts or things to lift you and help you relax and get you through the day.

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