Hello. I am new to this dream site. It looks like a very nice one, so I hope it's okay if I post one of the most powerful and troubling dreams I've had in a long time. However, I do dream long dreams that I remember almost every time I go to sleep.

This one is so "real" that I'm having trouble remembering that it was a dream, and isn't really still happening.

By way of actual background:

My first cousin, call him "Mike," and I grew up almost like brother and sister, although we lived 100 miles apart for most of our growing up. Really early, we lived in the same city, and same house (my grandmother's). Anyway, we were close friends.

When he reached the age of 12 or 13, I teased him and told him he looked just like his father. He narrowed his eyes at me and said in an ominous manner, "Don't you EVER tell me I look like my father!"

That was the first time I ever experienced him in this way. He had never before seemed frightening to me.

However, as he entered and experienced adolescence, I learned from my own and others' experience that he became a mean-tempered, mysterious, and sometimes dangerously violent young man. (Teenage violence in those days meant fighting and breaking someone's jaw, which he did -- not the tragic use of firearms like now.)

Well, when I was 18 and he was 19, we spent some time kissing in his upstairs bedroom, sitting on the floor. I wanted to have sex with him. I was a virgin, and very horny. I was always horny, until I started antidepressants a few years ago, to which I am extremely grateful for freeing me from my sexual urges.

On that occasion, he hinted that we would be married, and told me that he had been "watching me" as I matured. And that I was "true blue." I was totally smitten. We did not have sex, though.

I was a sophomore in college. That occasion was in August, and I thought passionately about him for the entire fall semester, and even looked up laws and cases about first cousins marrying. Such as that the wonderful composer Edvard Grieg married his first cousin, if I am not mistaken.

When I came home for Christmas vacation, and saw him then, he said nothing at all about our romatic passion of August. I finally said something about it, and even mentioned his comments about possible marriage. His response was bored and whiney: "Aw, hey. I was TIRED." Something about how could I expect him to make sense when he was as tired as he was that night?

I was furious. Hurt and furious.

The next and last time I ever saw him was at one of our large family dinners at my aunt's. I had brought my boyfriend of the time with me, who was visiting my family. Something was brought up about Mike being a conscientious objector. I chirped, "Oh! Nick is a C.O. too!" (I admit I was naive.)

Mike roared at me: "You don't know anything about it!"

Since that time, I have hated him and had nothing to do with him. He called me once from Canada, where he emigrated from the USA and asked if someone he knew could stay with me on their trip through USA. And I said No. On another occasion, he wrote me a letter about something or other -- must have been in a Number 4 (HARD, HARD, HARD) pencil, since the writing was barely visible on the white paper, and hence unreadable, although it was 2-3 pages long.

He has been married 5 times, with one child by each wife. His first wife had an illness where the doc said she was not suppose to get pregnant; he got her pregnant anyway. Another wife he had an affair with a high school girl, and even moved the girl in with the two of them.

He is, in my mind, reprehensible!

A few days ago another cousin emailed all the cousins about something else, and attached an old photo in which four male cousins were. The youngest was 8 and small in the pic, and the eldest was Mike, about 16-17, and very tall. That's probably what sparked the dream -- seeing his picture.

Now for the dream:

I'm living with my parents. Mike shows up and moves into the bedroom with me, saying his long-term (actual) sixth wife has abandoned him. And that he has come to marry me. I feel very mixed about this. One, flattered. Two, that I am "last resort," that he knows nobody else will have him. Three, why should I have him, knowing what I do about him? Four, very sexual. (Even in the dream, in my currently non-sexual state, I felt fairly sexual.)

We are lying in bed among warm and loose covers, talking.

Then, we are on the train, heading for our new home.

Then, we are in our new home, his home in Canada.

[It's been 2 nights, so I forget a lot of details.] But I realize he is going to try to boss me and make me into his slave, as it were. So I go down to the train station alone, and decide I will have nothing to do with Mike.

When I get to my own train station in my own city, it is one of the old ones with polished stone walls that reflect sound loudly. I'm standing in an upper floor, balcony-like hallway, telling a friend on the lower floor all about what happened. I am using "mike's" name [which, in reality, is much more distinctive and unusual a name than Mike], and also that he lives in Canada. After I start the story, I realize that there are a few people around, and probably even more I cannot see. So it's possible that someone who knows "Mike" might be overhearing everything I am telling, and know it's about "Mike" himself.

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: Age 64

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Marian,
Your detailed summary of the relationship with your cousin is helpful in understanding the possibilities of your dream. Since dreams are a tool to help resolve conflicts within life it may be your dream is doing just that in your relationship with your cousin. The following are possibilities I see within the dream.

My first impression was the dream was primarily addressing the relationship with Mike. But after I began to examine the dream in detail I began to think the dream was actually addressing your 'sexual' self more so than Mike. The beginning of the dream begins at the 'beginning' of your first sexual arousal {living with your parents} and then encounters the barriers then and now as to the relationship with Mike, and your sexual self. The mixture of emotions toward Mike and the inherent sexual feelings are related because of those life experiences that intertwine the two. In the dream you still have the sexual attitude you lost when you started taking your medication. These are the deep seeded aspects of who you are and although they are under control they still exist deep within.

The bossing part makes me believe the dream is addressing that aspects that once 'bossed' over you {Mike and sex}. You were a slave to both. Having nothing to do with Mike is also having nothing to do with sex {perhaps the dream is saying the real attraction to Mike was sex all along}.

The last paragraph seems to be using Mike as a substitute for your sexual self. The 'upper floor' often symbolizes the thinking mind with the lower floor representing the true emotional aspects that the mind may tend to overlook or repress {the ego is the conscious mind, the true self the unconscious}. The distinctive sound of Mike's name gives me cause to believe he represents some aspect of the sexual self, more so than just a 'mike' you are kin to. And like the real Mike, who lives in Canada, your sexual appetite also live in some distant place {due to the medication}. The people you can not see may represent aspects about yourself that are related to the sexual aspect.

Although your anti-depressant medications have freed you from your sexual urges they may also be affecting other aspects of who you are {in a somewhat negative manner}. But drugs can never put out the fires of the sexual body since they are inherent. Mike represent those inherent traits and since he still holds a place within your psyche {and always will} he represents that sexual desire that no longer exists outwardly, but will always be part of your inner self. The stimulus for all this was the picture sent to you recently. It brought back all the memories of the old self which has mostly been distinguished due to medications. But deep down their remains that fire, but under control. And so are is your attitude toward the real Mike.

You say you are happy that the medications have helped control your sexual appetite. But for much of your life sexual attitude was a primary force {I have similar experiences, both when it was a force, and now that it is under control}. The difference is the will and desire to act upon such attitudes. Since you have lost that desire your only true association is in your memories - or at least it seems to be. Would you again resort back to such attitudes if you stopped your medication? If so then the attitude still remains although you have found resolution with the problem by taking medications. And Mike? Being your first encounter, he too may seem to be what you want {sex} but that is under control from the wisdom of your experiences. As much as the dream is about the past experiences with Mike, it is just as much about your sexual self {of which neither no longer has control over you but remain deep within you}.

Your thoughts would be appreciated. Perhaps we will be able to see deeper into the possibilities if you can provide your thoughts to my assessment.

Gerard

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 56 Murfreesboro, Tn.

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Dear Gerard,

Thank you so much for your long and insightful interpretation of my dream.

Yes, your interpretation makes a lot of sense.

I wrote:

"A few days ago another cousin emailed all the cousins about something else, and attached an old photo in which four male cousins were. The youngest was 8 and small in the pic, and the eldest was Mike, about 16-17, and very tall. That's probably what sparked the dream -- seeing his picture."

And you wrote something about there being a relationship between Mike's bossiness and being a slave to my sexuality. That is more true than you even know!

For one thing, I was very attracted to the man who became my second husband, mainly sexually, because he looked like Mike. For another, after my second and also my third divorces, I realized that my constant sexuality was enslaving me, and forcing me to become involved with men. And that men always ended up ruining my life, no matter how I tried to find ones that I thought would treat me well. In both cases, I asked my doctor at that time to spay me, like a cat, and take away my sexuality, but the doc said this was not possible. So I was very glad the antidepressant I have now has removed my sexuality neatly. Other a.d.'s did a "messy" job of it -- such as, one kept my libido, wouldn't let me "come;" another one took away my libido but other aspects of sexuality were there; another one made me like a spayed female cat who found males so distasteful I could not stand close to them -- wanted to physically push them out of my range, and keep them away from me. This one, which I have been on probably 4 years, doesn't do any of that. It has just made me like a child, sexually -- just able to function fine without sex. But yes, I did have sexuality as a five year old, however, it did not affect me constantly. Only occasionaly when I was about to fall asleep I would wake up amazed and sexual.

Interesting, Gerard, that you say sexuality is still in my basic makeup. I'm sure you are right, although I had never thought of it that way. I'm actually sorry to hear that. I want nothing to do with it. It kind of worries me sometimes, that it might return. And Yes, I have no doubt in my mind that if I were somehow to lose the means or source of Effexor my major sex drive would return, and along with it my drive to find a man. In fact, I have one! He wants me for his girlfriend, but I have made it very clear to him that I am not "dating" or "girlfriend" material. He has even said couldn't we just have sex for sex alone? And I said, No Way. So we get together to go to theatre plays, or watch videos, but that's it.

And already he's even doing minor controlling acts: he wants to go with only me: doesn't want me to bring along any of my other friends, male or female. Says he likes to "go with only one person."

The guy uses a wheel chair, but is sexual. No where near as sexual as I was, from his description. And he has limitations, though from what he says, getting hard is not one of them. And from the waist up he is a HUNK. I helped him get into the Halloween costume I lent him, and saw him without a shirt. Hubba-hubba, whoopeee! I feel very sexually attracted to him (in my solar plexus area, not my groin like I'd used to feel!), which is why I keep clear of him most of the time -- I know the sexual feelings would fade and let me (and him) down quite soon; plus I know that if he were my boyfriend, all my other friendships would dry right up and I'd spend all my time with him. Then we'd start to fight. It's too darned easy to "become one" as the Bible says a couple should do.

flo

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Marian,
Thanks for your detailed reply. You have provided valuable insights to a problem that is not yet fully understood, anti-depressant medications and their interactions with the normal functioning of the human psyche. That function being sexuality.

My impressions are the medications you are taking have pretty much 'neutered' your normal instinctive sexual urges, yet not completely distinguishing the sexual desire. Because your sexual drive is {was} at a higher level than normal you associated it with failures in relationships. Mike was the first to 'heighten' your sexual desire and he betrayed you. Since then your relationship with men has been based on your sexual needs more so than the normal relationship one expects in a truly balanced love affair. At least that was the case prior to the start of taking your medications. Due to the medications you now have 'control' over your sexual urges. But do you really have control over the need to express yourself?
In your last post you stated the urges no longer reside in the groan area but still exists in the solar plexus {I take that as meaning you still have the desires but not so strong to follow through}. What many would see as a negative {decreasing sexual desires} using such medications, you see as a positive. But will that last?

I don't seek to undermine your attempts to control those aspects that you associate with failure in relationships. But I do have questions as to where you will end up, years down the road after taking the medications. Will these medications become like the others, offering relief in one area but causing more problems in another? What then? Hopefully that will not be the case but it could happen.

I have personal experiences in my own life where sex was the controlling agent, which led to 3 failed marriages. I saw sex as an outlet for sharing myself, but at that time I did not understand why or even question it {that understanding became obvious only after I began my education in Jungian psyche}. I honestly believe I unconsciously was using sex as a substitute for a lacking relationship with my father, and as a tool to prove myself. There was also the 'inferior' position I felt as a young boy being raised in poverty that added to my insecurities. I can still see that young boy {myself} in those instances, hurting, in need of assurances {my mother provided but not my father}. I wish no other child should have to endure {mine was not physical but rather psychological} such pain. I am convinced we all are affected in these developing years and if there is a lack of proper love and nourishment it will carry through the whole life if not resolved.
The approval I never received from my father was affected my adult life {seeking love in all the wrong places}. I had 3 wonderful women in my life but because of something within, that empty feeling I did not consciously understand and could not explain, I chose to seek comfort from other women. This is something that is not uncommon, I see it all often in others {even at the Forum}. The unresolved conflicts that are from the basic makeup of an individual are readily seen in dreams.

So my question is, and my curiosity raised, what are the underlying causes of your use of sexuality throughout your life? Was it similar to mine, from childhood and the lack of proper parental nourishment, or is it truly a physical handicap, or both? If it is as much a psychological issue and the medications start you fail you in the future, are you prepared for that? My advise is to explore those deeper possibilities, the influences of childhood. Even if the medications do their job it could only be a positive to understand any psychological negatives that lend themselves to a healthier psyche. Dreams attempt to do that when we sleep {it is a part of our psychological immune system}.

Another observation that you bring up I believe is important to understand. Repression of the sexual drive, is it harmful to other aspects in life? I tend to agree that a person can live a good life without sex, my mother {who is a true heroine, raising 4 children and sacrificing her own desires in doing so} did so for over 35 years {she remarried a few years back at the age of 69}. But I also believe there must be a substitute for that sexual drive {beyond the normal psychological negative issues}. That is where creativity can play such a hugh role in life. My mother used religion {rather successfully} as her substitute. Spirituality and creativity go hand in hand in Jungian recourse, the spirit being the basis for the creative self. It has been 15+ years since my last committed relationship and although I sometimes have those 'urges', they dissipate when I turn to my creative mind and let the intuitive juices flow out. Although I reject any one religion as the sole source of truth, I do believe in the natural spiritual self, much as Native Americans see spirituality. Not only has my creative abilities come to forefront, my sexual drive remains normal in the sense I have the urges but do not act on them because I do understand my past unconscious reasoning, and have another love in life that fill any void {Myths-Dreams-Symbols, creativity and exploration of the psyche}. There are no medications involved {aspirin only} but there is a regimentation of discipline learned from my studies of Jung and Campbell. And not only is there not a disruption of other normal psyche aspects, quite the contrary, there is an enhancement of those vital aspects needed to live a balanced and harmonious life.

So my question is, have you experienced any serious negative consequences in other areas of your life because of the medications? I know you did with other prescriptions but how do these affect your life, other than dosing your sexual urges? Looking deep within yourself, if you will comment on those aspects I believe you will be sharing some great information for others to understand.

I do want to thank you for being so open about yourself and sharing your experiences. It isn't easy confessing one's life for all the world to see. I do so without reservations because I have confronted those shadow issues and wish to help others who may have the need for understanding. Your sharing of your life and the uniqueness of that life can be a great help to others. Thanks for doing that.

Gerard

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 56 Murfreesboro, Tn.

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Dear Gerard,

I wish to thank you very sincerely for your sharing as openly as I do. This is unusual for me. Ordinarily on any forum except bipolar forums (where everyone shares with one another), people tend to hold back -- except for me.

The reason I share is for the reason you mention -- to let the world know how another person has been affected by whatever. In my case, those "whatevers" are many, including religion (Christian Science for a number of years); bipolar disorder with and without medications; medications themselves; the life of a non-professional artist, mostly musician but a creative person in general; my experience as a natural teacher (4th generation, plus plenty of college training plus wide experience); need for Nature in my life, which is presently missing; etc.

Incidentally, I am not clear about your use of the word: distinguishing. Did you mean "extinguishing"? You have used distinguishing twice -- once in each of your posts, concering my sexual drive etc.

To answer some of your questions.

Q.Have I experienced any serious side effects from the psychoactive medications:

A. Only two. One was lithium. Some people (me being one) it just does not work for. And I want to add first here, a couple of things. One, lithium treatment does NOT imply vitamin/mineral "supplement" or shortage of this mineral in someone's system! Just because lithium is naturally found in Nature, does not mean it is not dangerous! Rattlesnakes and black widow spiders and scorpions are "natural" too! Lithium is highly toxic, and when a person is rx'd this substance, they need to have frequent blood tests to analyze the amount in the blood to be sure it is at therapeutic levels, and not at toxic levels. Two, most doctors do not explain much about lithium (a salt) to the pt. I can say "most" in an informed way, because I have not only communicated with many people with bipolar disorder on web Bipolar Forums for at least 9 years, I also know people locally with bipolar disorder. And never has one of them been fully informed of what I'm about to say here which one bipolar passes on to another. That one MUST DRINK TONS OF WATER. If you don't, what happened to me, will likely happen. I was riding the bus with a man I knew from a bipolar group, and SUDDENLY I was gripped with terrible stomach cramping. Then I began to feel pangs of nausea, which got so bad I had to get off the bus and vomit into the gutter! He said, matter-of-factly, "Oh, that's the litnium. Have you been drinking a lot of water?" To which I said, "no." He explained that as lithium is a salt, it's necessary to drink a lot of water -- even much more if one is a partaker of caffeinated drinks such as coffee, tea, colas, etc, which take the water out of one's system. One should ask their doc how much water to drink, and they should carry a water bottle with them at all times ans and drink a lot all day. Then, this would not happen. Or at least not so severely. But lithium caused diarreah for me and I forget what else.

The other bad one for me was Serzone, which my present pdoc says "is a very bad medicine; I never rx it." That medication caused what I read later about it as, "a feeling of disconnectness with reality," and eventually caused me an instant blackout during which I fell on my head on the concrete sidewalk, barely missing falling into a busy street. I got two black eyes,and almost knocked out all the teeth on the left side of my face, which were loose along the jaw line for 3 days.

Other than that, the medications are okay except that, with the exception of the wonderful Effexor (which a lot of people do not like at all but is my life-saver) all the other anti-depressants would work for a while, and then taper off their effectiveness after a year or less.

Another thing -- my cousin was not the first to awake my sexual urges. He was only one of them.

As for whether I have problems in the future with my sexuality returning, or other problems caused by these medications. I'm asked this question from time to time, and generally in a less polite and concerned way than you have. In fact, usually the person asking has some political ax to grind. I tell them two things: One, show me someone with a formal diagnosis of bipolar disorder who has lived a pleasant and acceptable life for five years without medication, and I will consider getting off the meds. Two, I lived with suicidal thoughts and plans 24/7/365 from the age of 3 until the age of 54. I wept all weekend, every weekend; I had very little energy. I found things to worry about, came up with problems where other people saw none. I was extremely argumentative; talked way too much (this is called "speech pressure") and this was definitely something extremely difficult to put a stop to. I could have a tremendous will to let others in a group have their turn and not butt in, not say my point, not confront a point I did not agree with; not ALWAYS be the first to open up discussion. But I would never be able to keep my promise to myself. Now, finally, after several y ears of medication, I am fine and happy to listen to the points of view of others. I enjoy it, listen well, have many friends, am not obnoxious to have around. Still have plenty of creativity, and in fact it works better because I'm able to concentrate better. My creative focus MAY have changed; not sure about that. It has changed before I had meds, for various reasons.

I no longer cry all the time; I am not depressed; my ultra rapid mood cycling all day long is gone -- at least for a while, and anything is better than nothing. I'm sleeping better, in general. Overall, I have a better life, and I like myself better and people like me better.

When I have tried to wean myself off the medications, the "old me" with extreme depression came back after a couple of months.

One h as to have been there, to know how bad it is.

I had a friend who said she used to scoff at meds like Prozac, and feel like people who took them were -- you know the drill -- supporting the rich and greedy pharmaceutical companies, weak and could not deal with their lives....etc. But then, she told me, she was hit by clinical depression herself! And she was rx'd Prozac and did not know how she could have made it had she not had it! She told me she has completely changed her attitude towards those of us who use psychoactive medications.

Another observation I've made, although certainly not a scientific study! -- is that people who experience depression later in life -- maybe for the first time in their mid-20s -- are more likely to commit suicide after their second "attack" than those of us who have lived with it our entire lives.

Hope I struck on everything -- one cannot read the post one is responding to and write one at the same time. I really ought to cc/paste yours into a new Word doc so I can refer to it.

Oh, now I remember -- you wanted to know if my strong sexuality may have had anything to do with my childhood family relations, similiar to yours.

Yes, I believe it may have. With me, I had a very strong love-hate closeness with my father; it was my mother who was cold. Cool is a better word for her. She was, however, both on collaboration with my father in his cruelty towards me (extreme emotional cruelty, and physical, too) and did not protect me from his frequent beatings for litttle or nothing, many of which were for my daring to disagree with him or s tand up to him in a demand or argument. I fought to keep my identity. (My younger sister by 6 years tells me she saw what my brother and I went through with my dad, and learned to be the "pleaser." She never has developed an identity, to this day. She is almost 60.)

Also, where intimate relations with men are concerned: I will be 65 y/o in 3 weeks. I remarried last March after a relationship of 2 years. The man I married was as emotionally cruel as all the rest; I married him knowing he was dying -- he was already in Hospice, so I knew I'd be free soon. I have pictures of us in our sweet, small wedding, around my living room.

So that was marriage #4 if you count that as a real marriage, which it really wasn't, since it was not a serious commitment since I knew it would not last a year.

He was a dreamboat for a whole week! The second week after we married, he became a horrible, horrible emotional abuser, yelling at me -- worse than he'd been even in the prior two years. I had wanted to leave him the previous August, but when he got his cancer dx, I decided I could not leave him that it would be cruel to do so, so I stayed with him till death.

But his horrible relatives and the offspring of his late wife persecuted me so much, they even separated us for the last month of his life. It was horrible for me. And for him, too,as he was terrified of them.

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Marian,
Thank you for sharing. Although the forum's primary function is dreams and their interpretations, one can not deny that such an undertaking goes to the deeper psyche. And the healing process with that aspect is the goal if not the true intent of the forum.

As for being open. Dreams do not conceal {as Freud wished us to think} but they reveal. Being open about oneself is essential if there is to be a proper healing. All of the contributors {listed under the heading above} have experience in that aspect and wish to share those experiences for the benefit of others. That is the spiritual aspect of Jung's philosophy, and a requirement of the hero journey.

I will give a detailed response in the morning. I also want to address your response to my morning post since it does involve my spiritual mentor Joseph Campbell. He and Jung have provided so to learn from concerning the psyche.

And yes, I did mean to use extinguish. To make the same mistake twice, what was I thinking? Mornings are my best time to interpret dreams but perhaps not as clear when it comes to my vocabulary.

Gerard

Age & Gender & Location {Required}: 56 Murfreesboro, Tn.

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Gerard,

One thing I thought you were going to ask but didn't, concerning medications were: What is the effect, specifically, and perhaps the implications of, medications on dreams?

Some medications -- Seroquel, for one, which I presently take -- affect the dreaming of the person using this psychoaactive medication.

I only take 150 mg per day. My pdoc says some people take as much as 800 mg. per day. We know that other substances -- LSD, for one, which I have never used and never will -- affect "dreams" although maybe these are waking dreams? I don't know, having not read the Don Juan books. But LSD affects the brain. Does it really affect the "spiritual" side, as some people believe it does? And what about mescaline? The peyote cactus is used as a religious practice by some Indigenous people, I think, as is marijuana in their religious ceremonies. Tobacco, too. Tobacco is also useful for people who have schizophrenia. I forget exactly why it helps those who have schizophrenia, but it definitely does. You could probably find a zillion articles -- even medical journal ones -- by googline schizophrenia, tobacco; or schizophrenia, [whatever it is that's in tobacco -- where has my mind gone?]

Anyway, I sometimes wonder whether the dreams I have now that I take Seroquel, are "authentic." There are people who tell me they are nothing but drug induced states.

They seem quite authenic to me. But it would be fascinating to discover to what extent psychopharmaceutical agents like Seroquel for one, affect dreams, and how the dreams would if the person was not taking psychoactive medications.

Marian

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Marian,
I don't have evidence beyond what has already been written about drugs and dreams but I have little doubt that your dreams are authentic. If you dream, and the normal brain dreams every night, the dream contents are surely a product of the unconscious psyche. As I have stated often dreams are the psychological immune system. We know from many studies that dreams attempt to work through stress and problems of the dreamer. Just how drugs affect that process has not been studied to an extent that is definitive. And with all the new drugs that have been put on the market it will be along time before any studies will provide clues to their affect.

As for LSD. I have never used it and do not have a need for it. But I would one day like to take the drug under controlled circumstances to see if indeed there is a 'spiritual' affect. Of course since I already believe in a spiritual aspect of the psyche there may not be a need to experiment with LSD.

As for other drugs, including medications, the only one I have any experience with is marijuana. It is a drug that has benefits {restores appetite and decreases nausea} but the recreational use is not something I would suggest for just anyone. I never had a problem with it but it all depends on the individual. I do know it never made me want to try harder drugs, I'm not the type to depend on anything but my own wits. I see smoking a joint much like drinking a beer or glass of wine {I don't drink alcohol much anymore either}. But again it depends on the individual. I don't see it having any affect on dreams.


Gerard

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Hi, Gerard,

You wrote:

>As for other drugs, including medications, the only one I have any experience with is marijuana. It is a drug that has benefits {restores appetite and decreases nausea} but the recreational use is not something I would suggest for just anyone. I never had a problem with it but it all depends on the individual. I do know it never made me want to try harder drugs, I'm not the type to depend on anything but my own wits. I see smoking a joint much like drinking a beer or glass of wine {I don't drink alcohol much anymore either}. But again it depends on the individual. I don't see it having any affect on >dreams.

I don't drink alcohol much anymore either. As for marijuana, I had two good experiences with it, and a few others; one "bad trip" where I felt like I was "trapped inside my skull" and was looking out through two holes, namely my eye sockets. It was terrible and I was terrfied. Other times, it took me way too long to come down -- I'd have recurring "highs" for a whole day after I smoked. Finally, it just made me go to sleep.

I married a guy with whom I had smoked marijuana. I gave it up, he didn't. He deceived me terribly when he'd want to smoke it. We'd be having a good conversation, he would leave the room for a moment, come back, the conversation would continue, and maybe 20 minutes later he'd be a different person and I would not realize it till later. I felt totally betrayed. I felt like marijuana stole him from me. I hated it for this reason, hated him for doing this to me.

My attitude towards this type of "intoxication" -- willful self poisoning -- is that it takes away one's mind, and our minds are to be used as God (our Higher power, Nature, Divine Spirit, Who/Whatever) made them to be. I believe it is a wrong thing to use a substance like t his to deliberately remove our mind from the Mind of God. (It is a different matter to use them spiritually, or medically.) I do admit I am very prejudiced, as the people I have known who used marijuana ("Mary Jane," the "woman" they chose and were loyal to, over all "women" including the one they promised to love, honor, and cherish) were sleaze balls.

Marian

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